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Episode 151 Buy Episode

The First Nations Child Removal Class Action: What You Need to Know

Law as stated: 16 April 2025 What is this? This episode was published and is accurate as at this date.
Caitlin Wilson, Special Counsel at Shine Lawyers, joins David to discuss the First Nations Child Removal Class Action that is currently ongoing. Acting on behalf of the plaintiffs, Caitlin explains the legal foundations of the class action, the allegations of unlawful racial discrimination, and the procedural steps involved in mounting a class action of this scale.
Substantive Law Substantive Law
16 April 2025
Caitlin Wilson
Shine Lawyers
1 hour = 1 CPD point
How does it work?
What area(s) of law does this episode consider?The First Nations Child Removal class action.
Why is this topic relevant?Recently, a landmark class action was filed in the Federal Court, alleging various Departments of Child Protection in Australia have engaged in unlawful racial discrimination which has resulted in the unjust removal of First Nations children and the failure to to reunify First Nations children with their families following removal.

This action rehashes the painful legacy of the Stolen Generation, with powerful parallels being drawn between historical child removals and today’s child protection practices. This landmark class action has the potential to have profound implications on Australia’s child protection policies and broader cultural accountability and awareness.

What legislation is considered in this episode?Racial Discrimination Act 1975 (Cth) (Racial Discrimination Act)

Federal Court Act 1976 (Cth)

Children and Young Persons (Care and Protection) Act 1998 (NSW)

What cases are considered in this episode?Gerhardy v Brown [1985] HCA 11

  • The case concerned a charge against the defendant under section 19(1) of the Pitjantjatjara Land Rights Act 1981 (SA) for entering Pitjantjatjara lands without permission, raising questions of constitutional validity in relation to the Racial Discrimination Act. The Supreme Court of South Australia found that section 19 of the Pitjantjatjara Land Rights Act 1981 (SA) was inconsistent with section 9 of the Racial Discrimination Act, as it imposed a racial restriction on freedom of movement, rendering it invalid under section 109 of the Constitution.

Macedonian Teachers’ Association of Victoria Inc v Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission [1998] FCA 1650

  • The meaning of “based on” in section 9(1) of the Racial Discrimination Act could be differentiated from other terms used in anti-discrimination legislation, such as “by reason of” or “on the ground of,” which had been interpreted elsewhere as requiring a causal connection, instead meaning “by reference to.”

Wotton v Queensland (No 5) [2016] FCA 1457

  • In November 2004 Mulrunji Doomadgee died in police custody. Mulrunji’s death triggered civil unrest and a response from the Queensland Police Service (QPS). Justice Mortimer found that QPS’ response to Mulrunji’s death contravened the Racial Discrimination Act in a number of ways.
What are the main points?
  • Shine Lawyers have filed a class action lawsuit in WA and NSW against their respective Departments of Communities, alleging unlawful racial discrimination in the way they investigate First Nations families, remove children from their families, place them in out-of-home care, and fail to reunify them.
  • The class action also addresses the lack of funding provided to Aboriginal Community Controlled Organisations to assist First Nations families in navigating the child protection system.
  • The Aboriginal Child Placement Principle prioritises placing First Nations children with Aboriginal relatives or community members to maintain their cultural connections. Each jurisdiction has nuances in their implementation, with New South Wales consulting with extended family or kinship groups if a suitable person in the hierarchy cannot be found, and Western Australia considering non-Aboriginal caregivers who are culturally responsive as a last resort option.
  • The class action alleges the Departments have breached section 9 of the Racial Discrimination Act, alleging both direct and indirect discrimination.
  • Direct discrimination focuses on treating someone differently based on race, while indirect discrimination occurs when seemingly neutral rules practically result in disadvantages for certain groups.
  • The class members have been organised into three eligible categories:
    • First Nations children who were removed from their parents, guardians or carers;
    • First Nations parents who were investigated, or had children removed, following which the Department failed to reunify the children according to the Child Placement Principles; and
    • Willing carers who were nominated by a family member or applied to the Department to care for a child who had been removed, who were rejected or not assessed by the Department.
  • The systemic issues within child protection services that disproportionately affect Aboriginal families are the department’s intervention conduct, the use of risk assessment tools that have discriminatory impacts, and the standards imposed on First Nations parents that may clash with their cultural practices.
  • The action argues that the overrepresentation of Aboriginal children in out-of-home care highlights the urgent need for addressing these disparities and promoting culturally sensitive approaches in child welfare systems.
  • Applicants are not motivated by the potential monetary amount awarded as compensation, but rather the need for change and addressing the impact of historical injustices like the stolen generation.
  • The class action aims to bring about reform in the system, secure compensation for affected families, and hold the department accountable to the Aboriginal Child Placement Principles, to ultimately minimise harm to Aboriginal families.
What are the practical takeaways?
  • When trying to determine your future path in law, you should first look to identify your strengths and passions.
  • There are many opportunities to contribute to social justice in the law such as government, policy reform, research, academia, community legal centres, or litigation like class actions.
  • Understand the long-term nature of change and reform in these spaces.  Celebrate small victories, and recognise that even small efforts can contribute to larger movements for equality and justice over time.
Show notesAudit Office of NSW (2024), ‘Safeguarding the rights of Aboriginal children in the child protection system

Australian Human Rights Commission (1997), ‘Bringing Them Home Report

Davis, M. (2019) ‘Family is Culture: Independent Review of Aboriginal Children and Young People in OOHC in NSW’

DT = David Turner; CW = Caitlin Wilson

00:00:00DT:Hello and welcome to Hearsay the Legal Podcast, a CPD podcast that allows Australian lawyers to earn their CPD points on the go and at a time that suits them. I’m your host, David Turner. Hearsay the Legal Podcast is proudly supported by Lext Australia. Lext’s mission is to improve user experiences in the law and legal services, and Hearsay the Legal Podcast is how we’re improving the experience of CPD.

Hearsay the Legal Podcast is recorded on the lands of the Gadigal People of the Eora nation and we would like to pay our respects to elders past, present and emerging.

 Before we begin today’s episode of Hearsay, we also want to let you know that in this episode, we may say the names of First Nations people who have passed away. 

Today on Hearsay, we’re talking about a landmark class action commenced in the Perth and Sydney registries of the Federal Court, alleging that various departments of child protection in Australia have engaged in unlawful racial discrimination, resulting in the unjust removal of First Nations children and the failure to reunify First Nations children with their families.

Now, this historic action recalls the painful legacy of the Stolen Generation and there are powerful parallels being drawn between historical child removals and today’s child protection practices. This action potentially has profound implications for Australia’s current child protection policies and broader cultural accountability and awareness.

Joining us today to talk about the class action is Caitlin Wilson, Special Counsel with the class actions team at Shine Lawyers. Caitlin is a fierce advocate for justice, representing Australians wronged by governments, businesses, and organisations, and Caitlin is the lawyer acting on behalf of the First Nations class in this class action.

Caitlin, thank you so much for joining me today on Hearsay.

00:01:51CW:Thank you for having me.
00:01:52DT:Now, I’m really excited to talk about this class action. As I said just before we started, it’s not often we get to talk about such a historic action while it’s underway – sub judice, as it were. But before we get into it, I want to hear a bit about your journey and how you ended up doing this kind of work.
00:02:05CW:Hmm. Not a traditional pathway into class actions. I have been practicing in litigation for just over 14 years now, but I actually started practicing in family law and I’d always loved how dynamic family law was. Nothing was ever black and white, one case always different to the next and other areas of law often overlapped into family law, so might be – you need to know a lot about domestic and family violence or corporate law, criminal law, wills and estates – and at my last firm, I had quite a bit of exposure to international parenting and jurisdictional issues, which was fascinating. But as my career developed in family law, I found myself wanting more and more to use my legal skills for what I felt would be more impactful litigation. And as you do when you’re trying to figure out what you want to do when you grow up, I started talking to friends and colleagues about what that meant for me, and I can specifically recall talking to a friend of mine who’s a class actions barrister, and he was on the team that was running the Palm Island class action, or the Wotton v Queensland.
00:03:05DT:We talked about that action on the podcast before, actually.
00:03:07CW:Yeah, yeah! Yeah, fantastic, and a great example of a racial discrimination case. But I had that light bulb moment when I was speaking to him where I realised everything that he was describing about the work that he was doing was where I wanted to be as well. And I’d actually committed to doing my specialist accreditation in family law at that time, but I felt a real calling to make the move into class action. So I did that and I’ve been with Shine ever since.
00:03:35DT:Wow. Well, thank you, Caitlin, for coming on the show. We’re excited to talk about the case. We should say it’s at an early stage in the proceedings. I don’t think it’s yet had its first return date?
00:03:43CW:That’s right.
00:03:44DT:In either registry of the Federal Court. And at present, Shine is still identifying members of the class who may be eligible to register. Is that correct?
00:03:51CW:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. We’ve got our lead applicants for each of the cases, but still registrations are open and we’re really encouraging people to register. There is a lot of power in numbers and class actions, so it is really important that people register their interests and we can keep them up to date as to the progress of the matter as well.
00:04:07DT:Absolutely. Now, at the top of the episode, we did say this is a case that concerns Australia’s child protection policies around the country. Tell me a bit more about what the class is alleging.
00:04:16CW:So the class action is alleging that the Department of Child Protection – we filed in WA and New South Wales, so in New South Wales to the Department of Communities and Justice, and in WA, it’s the Department of Communities – but what we’re alleging is that those departments of child protection have engaged in unlawful racial discrimination. And it’s really in the conduct of the department in a few different areas, but it’s in the way that they investigate First Nations families; it’s in how they’re removing First Nations children from their families and why; the placement of First Nations children in out of home care, and also in the failure to reunify First Nations children with their families following a removal. And lastly, we also are looking at the failure of the department to proportionately provide funding to Aboriginal Community Controlled Organisations – they’re often called ACCOs – that would allow ACCOs to do their job properly and provide assistance to First Nations families in navigating the child protection system.
00:05:13DT:And is this a cause of action under the Racial Discrimination Act 1975 (Cth) or under state anti-discrimination legislation?
00:05:20CW:The class action is a human rights and discrimination claim and it falls under the Commonwealth Racial Discrimination Act 1975 (Cth).
00:05:26DT:So let’s dive a bit deeper into the cause of action. Your action talks about the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Child Placement Principle, which, maybe for ease of reference, we’ll call the Placement Principle. What is that Principle and why is compliance with that Principle significant or non compliance with it significant for the purposes of this action?
00:05:44CW:So in recognition of importance of connections to family, community, and culture, the Aboriginal Child Placement Principle was embedded into legislation in various times in various different states, but it’s effectively a placement hierarchy and it requires that when First Nations children are removed from their families, that they’re first placed with Aboriginal relatives or extended family or non-Aboriginal relatives and extended family. If it’s not in their best interest to do so, or someone’s not able to be found that is in that category, then placement with a member of their First Nations community. And if that person’s not able to be found, then a First Nations person outside of their First Nations community, but that belongs to another First Nations community or lives in close proximity to that child’s community. And placement with a non-related, non-Aboriginal caregiver or in a residential setting is a last resort. And as I said, each jurisdiction in Australia has embedded the Child Placement Principles into legislation with some nuances. So, for example, in New South Wales, if a suitable person in the hierarchy can’t be found, then the ACPP requires the Secretary of the Department to consult with the child’s extended family or kinship group or an ACCO as to who the child should be placed with. And in WA, the hierarchy includes, as a last option; a person who’s not Aboriginal, but who’s responsive to the child’s cultural needs and is willing and able to encourage the child to develop and maintain a connection with their culture and traditions of their family and community. And compliance with the Child Placement Principles is significant because it really acts as a measure as to whether the department is meeting its placement obligations and that, in turn, can provide a measure as to whether a child is being given the opportunity to maintain their connections to culture.
00:07:31DT:Got it. And the action alleges that that set of Principles, whether in New South Wales or WA, has not been followed?
00:07:37CW:Yeah, that’s certainly part of the claim. Nationally, around 32% of First Nations children are placed with Aboriginal relatives and kin. I think that’s fairly low. I would have expected when it’s embedded in legislation that it would have been higher, but from state to state, the compliance varies.  So, in New South Wales, it’s about 33.2% and in WA, it’s 39.5%. But we look at the percentage of children that are placed with non Indigenous, non relative carers – which is supposed to be the last resort – and in WA, that’s 30.9%. So the percentages aren’t that different. There’s a disconnect between the legislation and what’s happening in practice by the department.
00:08:17DT:And as you said, this is an action under the Racial Discrimination Act. That’s the source of the cause of action. It’s an interesting factual matrix in the sense that the discrimination that’s being alleged is a failure to treat a particular person in the class differently on the basis of their protected characteristic in the sense it’s a failure to take into account that protected characteristic in the way that they’re placed, and instead place them in a manner that a child who is not a First Nations child might otherwise be placed. Tell me a little bit about the elements of that cause of action and what the court will need to be satisfied of in order to make a finding in favour of the class under the Racial Discrimination Act.
00:08:54CW:Sure. So our claim basically is a section 9 claim and there’s two parts to section 9. There’s the direct discrimination, which is perhaps the more noticeable type of discrimination where a person is treated differently because of their race, colour or descent in our case.  And then section 9(1A), which deals with indirect discrimination. So where a rule, policy or condition that, seemingly, is supposed to be inclusive and applies equally to everyone, results in a disadvantage to certain groups. So, starting with direct discrimination; one of the leading cases on the requirements for establishing that is one that I mentioned earlier, the Palm Island case – or Wotton v Queensland. And it was considered by Justice Mortimer that there’s essentially two limbs that need to be established; there’s a conduct based limb and then an outcome based limb. And for an applicant to establish the claim under section 9(1), there has to first be an act involving a distinction, exclusion, restriction, or preference based on race. And this is the conduct based limb, and the focus is on differential treatment on the grounds of race. It’s not necessary that the race be the motivation for the conduct, but there must be the requisite degree of differential treatment, and this must have occurred by reference to the race of persons affected. And then secondly, the act must either have the purpose or effective nullifying or impairing a human right. So, the first one looks at what happened and its connection with race, and then the second limb looks at the outcome or consequences of what happened, and that directs attention to the actual outcome of the act. And what must be satisfied is that the claimant was not able to enjoy a human right or fundamental freedom on equal footing with others. And I think importantly – it’s not an answer to a complaint under section 9(1) that the respondent has acted reasonably or that there was an innocent explanation for the conduct or that it was an honest mistake or error of judgment. The question is whether there was a relevant distinction, exclusion, restriction or preference based on race. So that’s the direct discrimination. And then going into indirect discrimination – section 9(1A) – that’s where a person requires another person to comply with the term, condition, or requirement, which is not reasonable having regard to the circumstances of the case, and the other person does not or cannot comply with the term, condition, or requirement. Or, if they were to comply with it, it would have the effect of nullifying or impairing the recognition or enjoyment of the right or on equal footing to their counterparts – so the act of requiring the compliance is treated as an act that’s involving a distinction based on race, color, or descent. So what we have to show for the indirect discrimination claim is that the condition or requirement that the department has imposed on First Nations parents, by way of example, in seeking to be reunified with their children following removal, puts them on unequal footing.
00:11:40DT:Got it.

TIP: So Caitlin just mentioned that the action is being brought under section 9 of the Racial Discrimination Act, which is a cornerstone provision designed to prevent both direct and indirect forms of racial discrimination. In addition to section 9, the Racial Discrimination Act includes specific prohibitions against discrimination in areas such as access to public places, housing, employment, goods and services, and the right to join trade unions, these provisions ensure that discrimination is unlawful in concrete, everyday contexts. Complaints of racial discrimination may be assessed under both section 9 and these specific prohibitions depending on the circumstances. Section 10 of the Racial Discrimination Act complements section 9 by guaranteeing equality before the law. It overrides any Commonwealth or state or territory law that deprives people of a particular race, colour or ethnic origin of rights enjoyed by others. Unlike section 9, which focuses on acts of discrimination, section 10 addresses the discriminatory operation of laws themselves. For example, it invalidates laws that authorise the managing of property owned by Indigenous Australians without their consent, unless such laws apply equally to all individuals, regardless of race. 

Now, the courts have provided important interpretations of section 9 to clarify its scope and application. In Gerhardy v Brown, the High Court observed that section 9 targets discriminatory acts rather than legislative processes. However, section 9 can render state laws invalid when they conflict with its provisions, according to section 109 of the Constitution, where a state law permitting acts that section 9 forbids would be deemed inconsistent and therefore invalid. In the Macedonian Teacher’s case, the Federal Court clarified the meaning of “based on” under section 9, which should be understood as “by reference to” rather than the narrow interpretation of “by reason of”. Additionally, the court ruled that the Briginshaw standard does not automatically apply to findings under section 9 unless the circumstances of the case justify heightened scrutiny.

Now, we’ve also just mentioned the Palm Island Case. So that one is a 2016 decision called Wotton v Queensland (No 5) [2016] FCA 1457. That one is actually one that we’ve spoken about on the show before. We had one of the barristers representing the applicants in that case, Joshua Creamer, as our guest on the show to discuss it. That episode is episode 84 and is called ‘Voicing History: Wotton, and the Continuing Development of Human Rights Class Actions’, if you want to go check it out. 

As a quick rundown, the Palm Island Case centred around the death of Mulrunji Doomadgee and the subsequent events on Palm Island in November of 2004. Doomadgee, a First Nations man, was arrested on Palm Island after an encounter during the arrest of another individual. Doomadgee was placed in a police paddy wagon and taken to the Palm Island Police Station. Within around half an hour of his arrival, he was found deceased on the floor of a watch house cell. An autopsy revealed that Doomadgee had suffered severe internal injuries, including a cleaved portal vein, a ruptured spleen, broken ribs, and a cut above his eye. When this information was publicly read out to the Palm Island community during a meeting, it triggered immediate unrest. The community members were angered by the apparent police involvement in Doomadgee’s death and the lack of transparency in the investigation, and they started protesting. As a result, the police station and courthouse were burned down. In response to the unrest, an overwhelming police presence was deployed to Palm Island. The small community, which typically only had around seven police officers, and four on duty at any given time, suddenly had over 100 officers, including 30 members of the Special Emergency Response Team. These officers conducted 18 raids on 17 homes, arresting individuals suspected of involvement in the unrest. Many Indigenous residents experienced police raids that were later found to be discriminatory. It was found that police leadership failed to take necessary steps to engage with the community, despite knowing the likelihood of the unrest. Instead, emergency declarations were imposed, restricting the movement of First Nations people while allowing non-Indigenous individuals to leave the island freely. The Federal Court ruled that the raids conducted by SERT officers were a breach of the Racial Discrimination Act. However, claims for aggravated and exemplary damages were unsuccessful. The judge did not order an apology, although one was later issued, and while no individual officers were found personally liable, the state accepted responsibility for the discriminatory actions of their law enforcement.

We’ll come back to that condition or conditions that have been imposed the class members allege is directly or indirectly discriminatory. Before we do that, though, as you said at the top of the episode, you are still identifying members of the class who may be eligible to register and join the class. There are three specific classes of individuals who may be eligible. Can you tell us about those classes?

00:15:56CW:Sure. In short – it’s children, parents, and willing carers. The first class, the children, are First Nations children who were removed from their parents, guardians, or carers. And we’ve kept that fairly broad because what we want to include is cultural parents as well. But the key is that they were removed from their parents, carers, or guardians and placed into out of home care and not in compliance with the Child Placement Principles.

The second category is the First Nations parents, and there’s two subcategories in here. One is where the parents were investigated by the department and didn’t actually have children removed at all, but were investigated. And then the second is parents who’ve had children removed and again – non compliance with the Child Placement Principles or the department failed to take appropriate steps to reunify the children with them following removal.

And then the third is what we call our willing carers and those are First Nations people who were either nominated by a family member to care for a child who was removed or made an application to the department and their application was ignored, or not assessed, or rejected. And that was very deliberate, that we included the willing carers, because oftentimes we hear that they say the reason why they couldn’t comply with the Child Placement Principles is because there was no one available, and I don’t accept that based on the way that Aboriginal families are structured. It is very community based. But what we found when we started talking to our potential group members, that really was flushed out was, there were so many people that wanted to be the carer and the department just wasn’t processing their application, and in WA, one of our lead applicants is someone where she had to take the complaint all the way to the Ombudsman, and she was successful and ended up having the relevant child placed into her care, but it took, I think it was around 18 months to two years from her identifying herself in the first instance to actually having the child placed with her, and in the interim, this young child was placed hundreds and hundreds of kilometers away from his family, kin, and community. And the claim period is from March, 1992, onward. That’s when the class action regime came into place and under the Federal Court Act under Part IV. And the reason this eligibility criteria has been set is because there’s both general duties by the department to ensure that when a child is removed, where possible, the child is placed with a member of their family – and that’s not just for Aboriginal children, that’s for all children that come under the department’s care. But then specifically, there’s the rules relating to the placement of Aboriginal children, which we’ve discussed before – the Child Placement Principles. And so the criteria that we’ve set really follows those Placement Principles and allows us to focus on the failure of the conduct of the department when not placing children in accordance with those principles and obligations. And as well, it allows us to concentrate on the conduct of the department during the investigations or the time in which the child was placed into out of home care, and then the impact that the department’s conduct has had on those families as a result of their failures to comply.

00:18:58DT:And I suppose it’s probably worth – for listeners who are unfamiliar with the class action regime – to briefly talk about how you might go about identifying a class and what constitutes a class for the purposes of a class action.  Why, for example, you might have three discrete classes in, I imagine, separate actions that are running together rather than, for example, one homogenous class? So maybe could you tell me a little bit from the perspective of the Federal Court class actions regime, how you go about identifying a class of plaintiffs, categorising them and then identifying members of that class?
00:19:28CW:So for any class action to run, there has to be a group that has a similar cause of action and be affected by similar circumstances, and there needs to be at least seven or more people. And so when we started looking at the over representation of First Nations children in the out of home care system, it was very obvious to us that the children would be an affected category, as would the parents. And there are different criteria.  It’s the same conduct. Both of those groups are affected by the removal of the child, let’s say by the department, but the impact on them might be different or the obligations to them might be different. So, that’s why we’ve created those subcategories to allow us to run them together because there are a lot of common issues and common questions that need to be answered for both groups, like did the department engage in this conduct? And if so, what was the impact? That’s going to be common to all three of our groups. So it makes it more efficient for us to run this action together.

TIP:  So Caitlin was just discussing the class action regime. Class actions allow multiple individuals with similar claims to litigate collectively through a representative plaintiff or plaintiffs. This procedure, modeled after American style class action laws, as Caitlin mentioned, was introduced in the Federal Court in 1992 through Part IVA of the Federal Court of Australia Act and was later adopted in other states like Victoria, New South Wales, and Queensland. These actions help provide access to justice for those who might otherwise struggle to afford individual litigation, and they also promote efficient use of court resources. Now to initiate a class action in the Federal Court, section 33C of the Act sets out a few key threshold requirements. 

Now first, as Caitlin’s already mentioned, at least seven individuals must have claims against the same respondent arising out of similar or related circumstances, with substantial common issues of law or fact. These claims can be for various types of relief, such as damages or equitable remedies, even if individual assessment is needed between the claimants. The proceedings can involve different respondents or separate contracts as long as they share common legal or factual issues. 

Now, federal jurisdiction, which is essential for class actions in the Federal Court, extends to matters governed by federal law, such as consumer claims, product liability, and securities issues, or relevantly here, anti-discrimination laws. The court’s ancillary jurisdiction allows it to address related state law matters. However, claims purely under state law must be pursued in state courts, which has led to major state-based class actions – you might remember the 2009 Victoria Bush Fires or the 2011 Queensland floods. The determination of “substantial common issues” is crucial and hinges on whether the shared issue meaningfully impacts the conduct and outcome of the case. Courts have interpreted “substantial” as real and significant, not necessarily crucial to the case’s resolution. Also, since the requirement is similarly affected, it is not necessary for all members to be affected identically, section 33C(1) requires only that members’ claims arise from the same or related circumstances and present a substantial common issue of law or fact.

00:22:10DT:You said that the harm or, if you like, I suppose the gravamen, the root of the action was clear to you in identifying the first two classes; children who were placed or not placed, and their parents. Tell me a little bit about the harm suffered, or in the language of the action under the Racial Discrimination Act, the right or freedom that’s been infringed or curtailed when we’re talking about that third class of willing carers.
00:22:36CW:Yes, the third class, it’s an interesting one. The impact on all three of our classes is common in the sense that they’ve all experienced distress, harm, humiliation and a loss of connection to culture, and that looks different across our three groups. So for our children, theirs is probably more straightforward loss of connection to culture because usually what happens, particularly if they’re placed with non First Nations families, they’re not having sufficient or adequate connection with their culture and family while placed in that of home care, or if there are things like a cultural plan, they’re really tokenistic and to give a really good example, I’ve seen cultural plans where the extent of it was the child could watch NITV while in the care of their non First Nations cares, which is completely insufficient and really misses the mark. One thing that we see really commonly in cultural plans as well is they can attend NAIDOC week. Again, it’s just –
00:23:35DT:Tokenistic.
00:23:36CW:Very tokenistic. And oftentimes in cultural plans, the clan that the child is connected to isn’t the clan that’s reflected in their cultural plan. So for our children category, it’s more of a straightforward loss of connection to culture, and cultural standing as well, because oftentimes what we see is that these children end up self placing back with family at some point, either when they become of an age where they’re voting with their feet and it becomes difficult for the department to keep bringing them back to their foster families, or once they turn 18, they come back, but they’ve missed out on that connection in the interim and their ability to reconnect is hampered and they have lost a lot of cultural standing as well. For our parents, it’s the inability to pass on that cultural knowledge to their children and that affects their cultural standing as well. And for our willing carers, it’s the inability to fulfill their cultural obligations. So, a lot of times, and we talk about this a lot in the class action, is that the Western structure of the family is very different to Aboriginal structures and it is really community-based a lot of the time, and so, these willing carers are people that feel there is a cultural obligation on them to care for the child just as much as a biological parent. So, when they are ignored and not assessed by the department, or their application is refused, that’s the effect on them, is that loss of fulfillment, of cultural obligations.
00:25:06DT:Interesting. Okay. So we’ve got our parties, we’ve got our cause of action. We know the substance of the law around this. Let’s get into the meat of this. What is the conduct that’s being alleged? We talked about it a little bit in the sense that we’ve talked about the Child Placement Principles and the extent to which they’ve been substantively performed. We made a brief reference to the conditions that might be imposed before a parent can be reunited with their child, but we haven’t really talked about the facts in detail. So what’s the conduct that’s been alleged on the part of the Department of Communities and Justice in New South Wales, the Department of Communities in WA?
00:25:39CW:Sure. It’s complex in the sense that this is a systemic issue. So it’s hard to point to one individual action. But if I could summarise, I think the three main categories would be the manner in which the department intervenes with First Nations families and the risk assessment tools that are used to assess risk and effectively remove children. It’s the standards and conditions that the department imposes on First Nations parents to either avoid removal in the first place or to have children restored to their care, and it’s the way in which the department communicates with First Nations families.

So starting with the first one, when I say the manner in which the department intervenes with First Nations families, it does encompass a broad range of conduct, but to give a few examples, that might include investigating the circumstances of First Nations families without reasonable grounds to do so, or where a child was not at risk of significant harm. It could be using emergency orders to remove a First Nations child without reasonable grounds to do so, or in the absence of any preliminary steps.

Interestingly, in New South Wales, there’s a recent report by the Auditor General that showed that in 65% of cases where Aboriginal children are removed, they’re being removed under emergency orders, which means that they’re bypassing the scrutiny of the court in obtaining order in the first instance, so that’s problematic. It can be in failing to take the least intrusive action into the life of a First Nations child when deciding what actions necessary to protect them from harm, or, as we’ve touched on before, failing to maintain the cultural connection of a First Nations child once they are actually in the out of home care system.

But I think one of the best examples I can speak to is the actual use of the risk assessment tools. So, taking New South Wales, for example, they use what’s called the Structured Decision Making tools. And as I just touched on, the report from the Auditor General of New South Wales that came out in June 2024 concluded that the use of these tools disproportionately affect Aboriginal families, but the department is still using them. And the reason why they disproportionately impact Aboriginal children and families is because they rely heavily on factors that are correlated with race. So for families to be considered high or very high risk, the abuse score has to be nine or more for neglect, and abuse is eight or more points. And the factors that increase the risk levels for families, amongst other things, include if the family has four or more children, if the parent has their own history of abuse or neglect as a child, if there’s been prior reports to the helpline, and if there’s been three or more screened in Risk of Significant Harm Reports at the helpline level – that can actually raise the risk level by three risk points – or where a parent has had a history of mental health, alcohol abuse, or drug use. And even if those issues are resolved, and the person has been clean and sober for a period of time, that can still give them a point on this point system. And what we know is that the tools fail to take into account that these risk determinants affect Aboriginal families disproportionately. And what I mean by that is that Aboriginal families have historically and continue to experience over surveillance and over reporting at the helpline level. Aboriginal families and households are twice as likely as other families to have four or more dependent children. Aboriginal families also experience poor mental health and increased use of drug or alcohol misuse. And I think the key point to remember here is that that’s due to current and historical stressors such as the removal of their child or the removal of themselves as a child, and the impact of the Stolen Generation and the intergenerational trauma that’s resulted from that. So, when we take these factors into account, we can see how the use of those tools puts Aboriginal families on unequal footing and results in more Aboriginal families being flagged as being at risk in the system.

And then I think that this is in turn, magnified by the fact that in the event that the department caseworker is not satisfied with the risk level  that the tools have produced, they can actually increase the risk level themselves by one, so put the families at high risk.

So I think the tools themselves are discriminatory and disproportionately affect Aboriginal families, but then we have the opportunity for caseworker bias to come into play and put families in a high risk category when maybe they shouldn’t be. So that’s the intervention conduct, when parents move through the child protection system, so once a child has actually been in out of home care. I think some of the practices that lead to further discrimination are what we touched on before, so the standards that First Nations parents are required to adhere to in order to avoid removal or for reunification to occur, and often these are incompatible with their culture and First Nations customs and traditions. So, for example, a common condition that we see for reunification might include undertaking a parenting course or an anger management course or counseling or some form of rehabilitation. But for First Nations people, the challenge for them lies in that the location, the content of the course, or the course administrators themselves might be culturally unsafe. The time frames in which the department says that parents should or need to meet certain conditions or requirements are also problematic for First Nations people, because if it’s, “you must obtain stable housing,” for example, there’s really lengthy waitlists for these services, and those are often linked to the restoration goals and that restoration work is often limited to uncoordinated and cold referrals or long waiting lists. And another good example is, when decisions are being made around the permanent placement of a child, the department will often make determinations based on the Western attachment theory, and that’s a very narrow construct and involves a singular attachment for a child to their care, and it doesn’t recognise the importance of kinship relationships and cultural identity development, whereas Aboriginal frameworks recognise broader relational structures and networks of responsibility and obligation, including grandmothers and uncles, aunts and other kins, so it puts them at a disadvantage for reunification as well.

And I think lastly the challenge for First Nations people is the way that the department communicates with them, and that can be particularly challenging for First Nations people whose second language is English, or who live in remote communities who don’t have access to legal advice, or to an Aboriginal support person, or an Aboriginal liaison officer to assist them in their communication with the department, and I think that in turn highlights the issues that I talked about at the beginning, which is there’s a real disconnect between the level of funding that’s being provided to ACCOs to enable them to do their jobs. Nationally, Aboriginal children are 10.8 times more likely than non Aboriginal children to be in out of home care, but on average, the total expenditure to ACCOs is only 6% nationally and I think that’s pretty shocking. It’s so disproportionate. But then we look at WA, for example, and they boast the highest overrepresentation rates in the country. So they are 20.4 times more likely than non First Nations children to be placed in the out of home care system, but only 3% of funding goes to ACCOs.

00:33:05DT:Wow. The high rates, significantly higher than the general population rates of intervention, that 20.4 times statistics really bring to mind the historical injustices of the Stolen Generation. I want to talk about that in a moment. Something caught me in your description of those three heads of conduct, which is that the intervention tools or the risk assessment tools that are used to decide whether or not to intervene are still being used by the New South Wales government, as at the date of recording, I imagine, and would I be right in thinking that some of the conditions imposed on reunification of parents and children or conditions like them might also still be imposed today?
00:33:43CW:That’s exactly right, and they’ve really been developed. So we know because the report from the Auditor General in New South Wales was only June 2024, so this year.

TIP:  Now, Caitlin’s just mentioned a recent report from the Audit Office of New South Wales. That report is called ‘Safeguarding the Rights of Aboriginal Children in the Child Protection System’ and was published in June, 2024. Now, the audit looked at how well DCJ and its contracted NGOs were protecting the rights of Aboriginal children in the child protection system between June, 2018 and June, 2023. This comes amidst ongoing concerns about the overrepresentation of Aboriginal children in out-of-home care. By June of 2023, Aboriginal children made up 40% of the out of home care population in New South Wales, even though they represent just 7% of the state’s child demographic. This over representation has been persistent, with one in eight Aboriginal children seen by caseworkers entering out of home care. And further, as Caitlin’s mentioned, 65% of those cases began with emergency removal powers, which bypass standard safeguards. Now the audit revealed some serious issues. According to the findings, DCJ hadn’t properly embedded the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Principles into its governance or operations as required under the Children and Young Persons (Care and Protection) Act 1998 (NSW). This law ensures Aboriginal children and families have the right to stay connected to their culture and community and to have a say in decisions about their welfare. The audit also found that DCJ’s oversight system lacked performance measures and accountability specific to Aboriginal children, which led to poor compliance and ineffective application of these principles. The audit highlighted some clear areas where change is needed. It called for stronger governance, better accountability, and improved quality checks across the board. Some of the key recommendations included setting up a system to track how well the principles are being followed,  measurable goals for child protection practices, working closely with Aboriginal organisations to develop culturally appropriate solutions, and bringing in an independent review of the tools used for decision making.

So we know that those tools are currently in place and we had recognition and acknowledgement from the department that they do disproportionately affect Aboriginal children, but there’s no real plan, as far as I’m aware, for what’s going to happen. I think there’s some talk about changing them but there’s no real commitment, there’s no real outline, that I’ve seen anyway, as to how that’s actually going to be done, and I believe in Queensland they got rid of the structured decision making tools very recently.

00:36:05DT:Knowing that these tools are still being used, that as recently as this year, the department stands behind them as an effective decision making tool, I guess sort of red teaming your own case, trying to plan for how this case is going to be conducted, what submissions or arguments do you expect the department to make defending the use of these tools, especially given that they acknowledge they have an outsized or disproportionate impact on Aboriginal children and families?
00:36:33CW:That’ll be really interesting. I think that they’ll need to say that they have an obligation as the state to protect children and make sure children are safe, and they need to have some form of tools in place, and this was the system that was designed and I believe it started in America, but I don’t know how they’re going to answer certain questions that came out of that report, again, which was they were supposed to review these every five years and make sure that they were aligning with First Nations customs and traditions and were appropriate to be in use, and that wasn’t actually done, and they have known for some time that they’re disproportionately affecting Aboriginal families, but continue to use them. So that’s what’s really hard to understand is that we know that there’s an acknowledgement by them, and the only thing that’s happened is that the number of First Nations children in out of home care has been increasing, not decreasing. So, why there hasn’t been the change is a question that I’d love to see answered. Really curious to see how that’s going to be answered.
00:37:32DT:Is what you’re saying there that the defense of the use of that tool might be, well, yes, we know that a factor like, for example, historical alcohol abuse has an outsized impact on Aboriginal families or greater than four children has an outsized impact on Aboriginal families, but knowing that it has that outsized impact, we still have an obligation to protect children and that is a relevant consideration in making a decision whether or not to intervene? Reminding our listeners of our earlier discussion about whether something falls within 1 or 1A of the Racial Discrimination Act, is conduct that either directly or indirectly discriminates on the basis of race, colour or descent lawful if it is reasonable or achieves a goal like that notwithstanding?
00:38:13CW:So I think that actually draws out exactly what we’re speaking about here with the direct and indirect discrimination. So they’ve got these structured decision making tools and they apply them equally to everyone. But the problem is that it puts Aboriginal people at a disadvantage. And that’s the key for us is that it does not take into account Aboriginal customs, traditions, and ways of life. And so you can’t use those tools on-going, particularly when you know that it’s going to disproportionately affect them.
00:38:39DT:Interesting.

TIP:  So Caitlin just mentioned that DCJ uses Structured Decision Making tools. SDM tools are designed to help mandatory reporters, so DCJ staff and child well being unit practitioners make critical decisions in child protection and well being cases. These assessments aim to help agencies make decisions that are more consistent and reliable and hopefully reduce the risk of further harm to children and speed up efforts to provide stable and permanent care. Now, in New South Wales, our suite of SDM tools include the Mandatory Reporter Guide, the Screening and Response Priority Tool, the Safety Assessment, Risk Assessment, and reassessment tools, and the restoration assessment. You’ll find similar suites of SDM tools in each state and territory in Australia.

Let’s talk about the parallels to the Stolen Generation. I think any of our listeners familiar with Australia’s history of Aboriginal child removals will have been drawing their own parallels from our conversation. But let’s talk about that. I think it’s inevitable that that will be a parallel that’s drawn in media coverage of this case, probably inevitable that that parallel will be drawn in the course of submissions on the case. So let’s talk about that and I guess how the legal frameworks that govern child protection have changed between now and that time in Australia’s history. Historically, what did the legal framework for child protection or removal of children look like in Australia?

00:38:42CW:So, historically, there were state based child welfare acts across Australia and that was used to justify the removal of children. And the central legal principle around that was the belief that Aboriginal culture was inferior and Aboriginal children should be, quote unquote, rescued from their families, and integrated into white society.  And by virtue of the child welfare Acts, the state had wide ranging powers to intervene in First Nations families with no need for parental consent, and children were often placed in institutions or with white families, and as we know, children removed from their families were often segregated from other First Nations children and communities. They were isolated from their cultural roots and given European names and identities and not able to speak language and practice different customs, and since the 1970s Australian policy has shifted away from the overtly assimilationist practices, but I think it’s evident in the statistical data alone that the legacy of child removal has continued, and while modern child protection laws no longer explicitly aim to remove First Nations children from their families with the intention to assimilate them, First Nations children are still vastly overrepresented in the child protection system, and the current legal framework still sees a large number of First Nations children placed in out of home care with non First Nations families, often far from their communities, and that perpetuates the disconnection from culture and family, which was the hallmark of the Stolen Generations.
00:39:24DT:And there were some landmark class actions in relation to the Stolen Generation and the child removal practices that the Australian government had in the 1970s. Can you tell us a little bit about those?
00:40:02CW:Yeah. So one of the drivers toward the child protection reform in the first place culminated in the 1997 ‘Bringing Them Home Report,’ and that documented the widespread removal of First Nation’s children and recommended reparations and acknowledgement of trauma caused by force removals. And the report recommended financial compensation and mental health support and preparations for survivors of Stolen Generations and policies that would allow individuals and communities to seek redress.  And then from that report, we saw the national apology in 2008. There was an introduction of cultural competency training in some jurisdictions as well. The ACPP or the child placement principles became embedded in legislation at various times. There were a number of detailed reports and inquiries, including the ‘Family is Culture’ report in 2019 in New South Wales. There was the Yoorrook Justice Commission that was set up in 2023 in Victoria. There was the inquiry into out of home care in WA in 2014. And they all made numerous recommendations, which have been taken up in varying degrees from state to state, but a number of reparation and compensation schemes were introduced in various states and interestingly, some of the  schemes in particular – the one in the Northern Territory was only implemented following the commencement of a class action by shine in the Northern Territory for Stolen Generations.

So I think it really does demonstrate the power that class actions can have in driving reform.  And what happened there was that Shine started the class action and then –  I’m not sure exactly the timeframe – but I think probably about 12 months into the proceedings, all of a sudden, the Northern Territory brought in a redress scheme.

So, because of the eligibility of that redress scheme, what Shine did was look at what categories of people were not included and were not eligible under that redress scheme and pivoted and amended our group definition – and sorry I say we, I can’t take credit for it because I wasn’t on that matter – but the team picked up the people where there was deceased estates of members of the Stolen Generation who had died before the 5th of August 2021 – so that was the cut off date under the redress scheme – or who were living cares or siblings of children that were removed and then deceased estates of kinship group members. And that was recently just settled for 50.45 million.

00:41:32DT:One thing that’s always been fascinating to me about class actions, and it’s apparent in the Stolen Generations class actions, in the stolen wages class actions, even in the example in the Northern Territory that you just described, is that they’re a powerful tool for seeking justice for the class members, but they’re also a powerful tool for effecting systemic or political change.  The Northern Territory example is a great one in that it effected change without a judgment, in the sense that there was a substantive change to the law and to the remedies available for the class members before the proceedings had even been concluded. Of course, that’s a possibility here, but what remedies are you seeking in this class action? And how do you think those will contribute to systemic change in addressing these issues?
00:41:44CW:So, I think that cultural competency and making the child protection system more compatible with First Nations cultures is really at the heart of what our class action is about. Yes, we’re seeking compensation for families and great to have a public apology from the Department or the State, but what is equally as important is the policy reform in the child protection space. And so what we’re calling for is for the Department to actually work with Aboriginal community controlled organisations to review the existing policies and assessment tools utilised to assess risk and placement of First Nations children in out of home care  and develop new policies and assessment tools that actually have regard to First Nations culture, customs, traditions and practices, to implement cultural awareness training specific to implementing child protection systems on an annual basis that’s actually developed by ACCOs as well to develop culturally appropriate information and materials utilised within and by the department to assist First Nations people in understanding the department’s child protection system processes and procedures, and also to develop a family group conferencing model where extended family are involved in decision making about the care and protection of First Nation’s children, that again, is designed, led and delivered by Aboriginal community controlled organisations.
00:44:00DT:So, of course, there’s that compensatory element, I suppose. In one sense, you’re not limited, but your framework for seeking remedies is in large part governed by the Racial Discrimination Act, but there’s an opportunity to not only seek compensation for the class members, but also affect systemic change.

Something that I’ve become aware of when we talk about strategic litigation, especially when brought by a single plaintiff or a small number of plaintiffs who don’t represent a class, for example, is that it can be difficult to obtain, for example, a judgment that may affect change that may result in a finding that, for example, a procedure or policy or framework used by the government is unlawful, where there’s this pressure between settling the case in the interests of the individuals in whose name the case is brought and, achieving that historic judgment. I think we saw that in some stolen wages cases where the settlement amount reached for members of the class could transform the individual’s lives, but to accept it would mean to accept not taking the case to a final judgment and making law. Tell me a little bit about the tension there, I guess, in the sense that you can be quite invested in the hope for, or the aspiration for systemic change, but at the end of the day, you represent the class members and their interests, which may be served by a compensatory outcome.

00:44:40CW:Yeah, you’re right. It is always a push pull. What’s really interesting, and we’ve done a few different outreaches in finding our lead applicants and talked to hundreds of group members, and not one of them has said to us, how much am I going to get out of this? What’s the compensation value? It’s not a priority for them. The priority really is that there has to be change because they really do see this as a continuation of the Stolen Generation. It’s just not being done as overtly as it was previous. And what’s so frustrating about it for these communities and for people that work in this area and have done such amazing work, and again, I referenced Megan Davis’s ‘Family is Culture’ report that have led the way and have said, “hey, we really need to pay attention to this issue. It’s at a crisis point and there’s still no change,” what we’re really hoping for is that unlike a reporter inquiry, where we get some media attention around it for a particular period of time, with a class action it’s not going to go away.  There has to be either an agreed outcome or a court decision on it, and it gives us that opportunity to negotiate and hopefully come to an agreed position with the respondent and the department because there also is a recognition by them that what they’re doing is not making the situation better.

The statistics speak for themselves and there is an acknowledgement that Aboriginal families are disproportionately affected. So you would have to think that this is now a real opportunity for them to know that a class action is not going to go away. We’re now in court, and so we’ve got an opportunity to strike a balance between ensuring we get compensation for families because they absolutely deserve that, the impact is immense on them, and a bigger acknowledgement about that impact as well. And a public apology is one way to do that, but I think there really does need to be an element of that reform in the system. And I think that’s the only way that this class action will go away, that the numbers will start going down and the department can start being accountable for contributing to the downward trend rather than the upward trend.

TIP:  In New South Wales, there seems to be a growing and troubling over representation of Aboriginal children and young people in out of home care. To understand why this is happening, the New South Wales government launched an independent review in 2016, led by Professor Megan Davis. The review focused on the experiences of 1,153 Aboriginal children and young people who entered out of home care between July, 2015 and June, 2016. The findings were released in November, 2019 In a report titled ‘Family is Culture: Independent Review of Aboriginal Children and Young People in OOHC in NSW.’ The report highlighted many troubling trends and practices and concluded with 126 recommendations for structural reform, along with over 3,000 recommendations tailored to the individual scenarios of the specific children and young people it reviewed. We’ll include a link to the full report in the show notes if you’d like to take a further read into that one.

00:45:59DT:You’ve talked about how cultural competency and better cultural competency training might be an outcome that you’re hoping to see from this class action. You’ve also talked about speaking with members of the class in preparing the case. Tell us a little bit about how you’ve upskilled in cultural competency, the sort of skills that you’ve used in talking about these traumas, these sensitive issues with our class members.
00:47:18CW:Yeah, so, I mean, Shine is fantastic at ensuring that all of our staff members have cultural competency training and awareness and trauma informed training as well, but we’re very fortunate to be working with two Aboriginal barristers. There’s only a handful of Aboriginal barristers in Queensland and Josh Creamer is one of them.  This class action was really his brainchild, so we really look to him to guide us in our cultural competency skills. And we also have Melia Ben, and I think she’s one of four female, or maybe she’s one of two female Aboriginal barristers in all of Queensland, and we’re very lucky that it just so happens that Melia and Josh both work in class actions.

So they’ve really helped us in understanding our obligations to ensure that we’re culturally competent when speaking with these communities. And I think that  the commonality for us too, is that the child protection system itself is not designed with Aboriginal people in mind and it’s not set up to accommodate the unique requirements of First Nations peoples, which we’ve become more and more aware of in working with Josh and Melia and Aboriginal communities.

And things like gratuitous concurrence or body language or the different meaning or interpretation of English language can be very different in Aboriginal communities and how that then plays into the department’s assessment of them is often what is missed and is resulting and contributing toward that over representation. So I think it’s really important that we get the system itself right and the way that we communicate with Aboriginal people needs to be one that is compatible with their culture and customs and traditions.

00:50:21DT:Which, as you said, is another part of the conduct that’s alleged, right? There’s the risk assessment tools. There’s the decision that is made that is disproportionately affecting Aboriginal families. But it’s also the way in which the department communicates those decisions or collects information in order to make them that’s not culturally informed. We should say Melia and Josh, both previous guests on the show who have been on to talk about, well, the Palm Island class action as well. Josh came out to talk about that. If our listeners are interested in hearing more about class actions and the Racial Discrimination Act, they should go ahead and listen to that one next. Caitlin, we’re nearly out of time. Before you go, I know many of our listeners at law school would have aspired to do the kind of work that you’re doing, work in the public interest, work on social justice causes. We also have a lot of law students who listen to the show, who hold those aspirations.  Speaking to some of our younger listeners or some of our listeners who are newer to the profession, recent graduates or law students, who do aspire to do this kind of work – strategic litigation, public interest litigation, social justice causes, what advice would you have for them to start getting involved in this sort of work?
00:50:45CW:You know, there’s so many ways in which social justice and human rights issues can be tackled and it might be working in government and policy reform or research and academia. It could be on the front lines at a community legal center, or in litigation, like class actions. So I think it’s figuring out where your strengths lie and how you can lend those skills to driving the social justice issues, and most importantly, ones that you’re passionate about. But I think it’s also important to understand that there is, you know, a very long term nature of change and reform and in the social justice and human rights space, and you really need to be prepared for the long road, but it’s so important to celebrate the small victories too, along the way, and even the small efforts can contribute to larger movements for equality and justice and help to lead to significant change over time. So I think it’s really important to celebrate all small victories along the way and all the small steps that are contributing to the greater good.
00:52:29DT:Well, Caitlin, it’s been great having you on the show. I’m really grateful for you giving up your time to tell us about the class action that’s currently underway. I’m sure a lot of our listeners will be following the action in the media and in the law reports. I know I will, and we’d love to have you on again very soon to give us an update on it. Thanks very much for joining us on Hearsay.
00:53:31CW:Thank you. It’s been my pleasure.
00:54:27TH: As always, you’ve been listening to Hearsay the Legal Podcast. We’d like to thank our guest today, Caitlin Wilson, for coming on the show. Now, if you’re interested in learning more about cultural competency, why don’t you check out our episode 92 with Avelina Tarrago and Melia Benn. That one’s called ‘The Culture Compass, Navigating Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Perspectives in Court’ and it’s a really interesting one, you should go check it out.

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